IC Forum Archive

finnagain · Posts: 181

Okay -- I know we've got a lot of indie-rock fans here in the IC community. Some of us may have seen Bonnie 'Prince' Billy tour this fall/winter.

He played three shows in Portland, OR, at this little theatre called 'the Mission.' I saw two of them.

I am still not sure if they were among the greatest concerts I've attended this year, or the worst I've attended ever.

Was anyone else at the Portland shows? Or at any of his other tour stops?

Wanna talk about it?

dhex · Posts: 2963

never seen him. what happened?

finnagain · Posts: 181

The old horror stories about Chan Marshall's weird, erratic stage behavior -- very applicable to Will Oldham, on the basis of these two shows.

Saturday night was entertaining in the same way hanging out with a small group of very drunk friends while you are sober is entertaining. The venue - a theater called the Mission, not designed for rock concerts to say the least - had terrible acoustics, and whoever was responsible for mixing was pretty derelict in their duties.

The string section, who played like they had just been hired that afternoon, occasionally lost track of the Oldham brothers' helter-skelter "we'll play whatever comes to our head at the moment" style. Interesting effect, at times, but very dissonant.

But despite all that, whatever it is about "Will Oldham," that I love -- the is-he-sincere-or-is-he-ironic question, the death-creek voice, the opaqueness of it all - shone though.

My assumption is, he was pretty drunk.

108 · Posts: 2600

He tends to be pretty drunk, yeah!!

My impression was always that you don't summon a string section unless you also have a definitive setlist. And you must also actually practice with the string section.

Not that I've any experience in that. Though hell if I've seen a lot of completely lost summoned violinists (or cellists) in some shows over the years.

internisus · Posts: 961

Molina > Oldham + Billy

Chan played at my university once. I tried very hard to make her feel more comfortable after she ended the show by running out of the room and hiding in a storage closet, but I think I made things worse. She gave me a hug when everyone was leaving the building, though.

I really love her, too.

internisus · Posts: 961

Plus, everybody check out Early Day Miners - The Sonograph EP

finnagain · Posts: 181

I think the Molina/Oldham comparison is a bit unfair to both of them.

This is a bit of a generalization, but Molia writes and sings with a direct, unambiguous cadence. The reoccurring symbolism (wolves, serpents, owls, blues, rain, roads, etc.) always suggests the same emotional ground. I'm sure he's written a "happy" song (and Captain Badass, on Axxess and Ace, COULD be a "happy" song if the narrators were taking any pleasure from their one-night stand), but he'd rather cover Warren Zevon than make a joke of his own. This isn't a criticism - I mean, I must have listened to "Pyramid Electric Co." and "Didn't it Rain" more than anything else in the past few years - but the message is direct. With that huge-sounding voice of his, he can't help sounding direct.

Where Molina is direct, Oldham is ambiguous, shifty and confusing. Take a listen to "My Donal," an Oldham track on the Amalgamated Songs Of Rest EP -- Amalgamated Sons of Rest being the short-lived Molina/Oldham/Alasdair Roberts group -- sometime. It's kind of a re-write of the old English folk ballad "A Sailor's Life," that becomes, in the final lines, a joke. A joke about gay sailors, no less. But the punch-line is delivered by Oldham in such a sincere, honest-sounding way that one wonders what exactly he's trying to get at.

I don't think I would want to be without EITHER musician, really.

I've never seen Chan Marshall perform -- if the anecdotal evidence is true, I don't think I could handle watching a woman I respect and value disintegrate in front of me -- but it does sound like she's cleaned up a bit. There was a New York Times article recently about her current sobriety, although by now I imagine it is locked away in Times Select.

dhex · Posts: 2963

so what was chan's problem? my wife was devestated when she cancelled that last tour, though to be fair the greatest cured me of any real interest in her musical output from here on out.

i realized i lied earlier in this thread; i have seen will oldham, opening for gybe! in hmmm 199x (98?) at the bowery ballroom. he was very good, and didn't seem drunk at all. i'd never heard of him before, and i remember thinking "64" was pretty insane. a lot of his stuff is basically being baffled by the feminine, actually.

finnagain · Posts: 181

Chan Marshall was (is?) notorious for canceling shows at the last minute, playing halfway though songs before giving up, and other non-professional behavior. She also had (has?) serious drinking and drug issues.

The New York Times article -- I found it, but it does require TimesSelect to access -- can be found here.

here is a little excerpt:

finnagain · Posts: 181

The only question about her account is: if she was drinking that much AND taking Xanax -- how is she still alive?

Benzos and any other downer at the same time WILL kill you, no matter how great your tolerence for each downer is. That is, like, the first rule aspiring drug addicts learn.

finnagain · Posts: 181

dhex wrote:

a lot of his stuff is basically being baffled by the feminine, actually.

That's a good way to put it; it's sort of like he can't think about death without thinking about sex and vice versa.

dhex · Posts: 2963

finnagain · Posts: 181

dhex wrote:

i mean, if benzos and booze killed people too regularly there'd be no fratboys left.

True -- but my HIGHLY uninformed guess is that most drug-related deaths are not the result of taking too much of any one drug, but mixing and matching drugs that should not be mixed and matched.

Having spent time working for NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness), I met quite a few dual diagnosis types -- people with a pre-existing mental illness who subsequently develop a substance abuse problem -- and almost all of their overdose stories were heroin-and-benzos or booze-and-benzos deals.

I should have been a bit more specific -- if, during those dark drunken days Chan was exorcising her bad spirits, she happened to down all that booze and take more than double her normal dose of Xanax, she got VERY lucky.

But rock stars seem to live though things that kill non-rock-stars, for some reason.

EDIT: Drug abusers are also notorious liars about their habits. Remember the James Frey dust-up thing on Oprah earlier this year?

dhex · Posts: 2963

antitype · Posts: 1148

I liked I See a Darkness (two years ago — I haven't listened to it since), but cursory listens to a few of his other records never quite grabbed me in the same way. Is there anything else I should hear?

finnagain · Posts: 181

I'd definitely recommend Palace's "Viva Last Blues," but... you know, if you don't respond to something, you don't respond to something.

The live record, Summer in the Southeast -- which sounded NOTHING like the show I saw -- is kind of a neat, muscular re-interptretation of a lot of "I See a Darkness" tracks.

The new record, "The Letting Go," is pretty good, for me. Also, the man behind this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fASJuCtBgrw

is the same man behind this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHuaJo46Pjc

He's so sincerely insincere.

internisus · Posts: 961

finnagain wrote:

I'd definitely recommend Palace's "Viva Last Blues," but... you know, if you don't respond to something, you don't respond to something.

The live record, Summer in the Southeast -- which sounded NOTHING like the show I saw -- is kind of a neat, muscular re-interptretation of a lot of "I See a Darkness" tracks.

The new record, "The Letting Go," is pretty good, for me.

That's funny. Molina just released a solo record called "let me go, let me go, let me go".

Clash! · Posts: 631

I really like this guy, everything I have seen with him I have enjoyed watching him.

Too bad I don't really like his music at all. I want to try listening to more, but I just keep wishing it was more ocean side or something. Rather than depressed mountain man.

finnagain · Posts: 181

Clash! wrote:

I really like this guy, everything I have seen with him I have enjoyed watching him.

Too bad I don't really like his music at all. I want to try listening to more, but I just keep wishing it was more ocean side or something. Rather than depressed mountain man.

There's a lof of sides to the man -- although the dominant one, and my favorite, is the "depressed mountain man." Maybe "Ease on Down the Road," which is a happy record by his standards (pretty much every song is about how great family is), might rock your socks.

And if you love sea chanties, there's always the Decemberists.

Clash! · Posts: 631

finnagain wrote:

And if you love sea chanties, there's always the Decemberists.

Yeah, but they are a bit too Drama club for my tastes.